Call to Order: The meeting was called to order at 6:05pm. Pledge of Allegiance Roll Call of Board Members: All Present UNFINISHED BUSINESS: 1. Discussion of the Wells Fargo refinance Tina discussed the bids she has received for refinancing. At this time she is waiting for four additional institutions to get back with her. Zion bank is willing to give a 20 year loan with a fixed rate for 10 years. This loan will not need an appraisal. She also discussed a HSE government loan that would require a number of reports, 1/10th of 1 years payment must be set aside, but the interest rate is lower and locked in. HSE works in the capacity of a broker, and there would probably be a fee if we chose to back out. The quotes she has received are only estimates. The banks will not give solid numbers until the loan is locked in. See worksheets with breakdown for Zion and HSE. As other financial institution quotes come in she will update this spreadsheet and e-mail it to the board members. (See bids) There was a discussion about the difference in fees requested by banks. Tina stated she believes the initial numbers we have received thus far stay in the projected budget. Jim Doskocil agreed. CALL TO THE PUBLIC: Chairman Jim Doskocil requests we move to Call to the Public at this time. Randy James has a presentation he would like to make. Randy James said in 10 to 12 years it will not matter what board members or fire chief we had. We will have looked like geniuses because of the amount of money we have had coming in to this department. Randy wrote a 5 year break down on the white board with estimates of assessed values, capitol carry forward, and budget. Randy emphasized the need for a greater percent on the mark-up of all expenditures because of inflation. 2. Review and discussion of the 2010/2011 Fiscal Year Budget Tina discussed the letter received from Coconino County concerning ‘corrected’ assessed valuations. The county made a mistake in their calculations. She said the budget they have now reflects this change. She also discussed the new time tables for publishing and posting the budget. The letter states that if these new procedures are not followed FDAT funding can be removed. Don believes this letter should have been mailed in January concerning the change in times frames, not May. Tina assured the board all time tables would be met. Don reminded the board members that no final vote can be made at this budget work session. He asked the board for direction concerning the Maintenance and Training Facility. Summit Fire District (SFD) had a required public meeting this past week for the training facility. Peggy McClure mailed letters to residents. There was no public show at the meeting; therefore they are continuing their plans. There was a discussion held about the training facility. Yearly payments would be $12,835 per year, and the maintenance facility approximately $34,000 a year. Jerry Loynachan said it does not seem right to do the training facility, but with such safety issues and high priority he would like to vote yes on both facilities. Jim Doskocil said with all the places we are looking to cut within the budget, not wanting to max the mil rate or cut ‘line guys’ jobs he believes it is not a good time for this. Jim talked about cuts other cities have done with small departments. Jim said SFD needs to wait and see what is coming down the road. Depending on what comes up in the next year or two could be more dependent on where we go with this. Jim talked about the economic climate and the changes the Phoenix departments are making. Flagstaff Fire is taking their 2nd pay cut. He hopes things get better quicker than we think. Gary Selig thinks we may be putting too much into infrastructure and has fear of losing employees. He said we should not expand now with what is going on in the world. Rick Parker believes the same. Safety issues are important, but we have other options for training we can work on. We have to look at long term and whether we spend the money now that will likely have additional expenses. We have gone without it up to this time, though Rick said he believes it is important. There was a discussion about SFD using the Flag Fire facility for training. Don talked about multiple companies training and the overtime it would cost to use it for this purpose. Also there would be fees if we were not using it with them. There was a discussion about logistics and travel to the city facility. Don discussed financing the facility for 10 years at $13,000 per year. The training facility committee made a presentation to the board previously about design and costs. Don believes this facility stands as a moral issue with our folks. They need to be trained like real firefighters. This training reflects real safety factors with making entry and high risk - low frequency events. These are the ones they need to be prepared for, for their own safety. Don said possibly some items in the design could be adjusted or adapted to possibly change the price from $100,000 to $85,000, then possibly the board would change their mind. Rick asked about the initial payment of the building, and what would the costs be for overtime to do the training. Don said at this time we are trying to cut back on overtime. Rick asked about the equipment; water, chemicals and artificial smoke to work this facility, and are these costs negligible. Don said these costs have been put into the budget – they are hundreds, not thousands of dollars. Rick said the yearly costs of maintaining, utilities, and other costs would be $15,000 per year. Don said that number would be at the high end. Dan Atkinson asked about former training. There was a discussion about City Station 3, the training there, and the new facility for the City at Wildcat on Route 66. Don thinks live fire training is critical. Getting into a smoked environment you forget what it is like when it is not done very much. Visual blockage, smoke preparation, and 600 degree heat are some of the factors these guys need the chance to deal with in training for low frequency events. Rick asked about other opportunities for income on the training facility. Don said there would not be any substantial cost. Highlands Fire District is looking to build a new training facility 3 years down the road. Dan talked about the budget we have now and likes the way it has been planned. Step increases have been put in for every year, but it is not congruent on going to ‘bare bones’ in other aspects. Dan believes firefighters need to be properly trained. We cannot ask them to go into burning houses when they have had no training, or proper training. That is a responsibility of the board members. From what he hears at this discussion is that for 14 thousand dollars a year we are unwilling to build a training facility. Firefighting is a different profession. Possibly only one time a year a firefighter will be asked to pull someone out of a building. We are paid to be prepared. Dan said he was a volunteer Firefighter with TFFD and does know the importance of training. Many serious injuries happen to firefighters because of conditions, and those could happen more with no training. Our payroll is $2.9 million a year, but what I hear we can’t afford 14 thousand a year to train them on possibly the most dangerous encounter they could go on. The money is coming out of our capitol carry forward, but it is also our savings account. These years we will have to use some of our savings account. The board members we have who are firefighters can appreciate the factor of training and firefighter safety. We have been very fortunate with a low incident rate. With the way this budget package is projected, we are still able to give a raise for the next 5 years. Dan is very much in favor of building the training center. Rick thinks the facility is a good idea but asked what do we do in 5 years down the road when we need that money? Can we watch the economy and then next year re-look at it? Can we see what taxes and real estate is going to do? Rick asked if someone could meet with the union and see if they have recommendations for this. Gary said it is not the training facility they (board members) are against, it is the cost. Gary said he believes it is a duty to cut costs. Don spoke about a number of items. Summit has not been hurt by this economy yet. How best will we get through this, and what are our priorities? He believes that for these guys the training facility is high on the priority list. The training facility would help morale. He will talk with the firefighters before the next board meeting to answer Rick’s request. Jerry said personnel have been asked to cut the budget, yet still maintain operations. If the cuts they made previously are really bare boned, then the money allocated for wages is the only place we can cut money in the budget. Jim said he wonders why we have the training facility still in the budget at this time. Jim talked about the City of Flagstaff Firefighters salary cuts. Many are taking a 3 to 4% cut. Jim said the cuts to SFD are coming, and he believes other areas need to be cut back also. Next year this can all be reexamined. Don emphasized that fiscally we know where we stand for the next 3 years. Jim thinks other areas need to be cut back also. Jerry said maybe this year we can look at not giving a step increase. Dan Atkinson spoke of the Wildland income made by the department in the past. Dan suggested money generated from Wildland can go to capitol carry forward. Jim said Wildland money is not a guarantee. Don spoke of his request to SFD personnel how important it is for everyone to be engaged in Wildland this year and the commitment needed by everyone this season. Chris Fennell spoke about the training facility. He said the staff at SFD is all for it and behind it. Chris spoke about how they try to train with what they have. He said the facility committee is doing a great job not only fiscally, but also on how it would be built and what types of training they will be able to do. Fennell himself has not been in live fire training in 7 years. He spoke about the difficulties to get all personnel through this much and type of training. His real concern is these trainings do not happen often enough. It is important to train as a shift and crew, and know how they work together. You don’t find out what really happens in the chaos and confusion until you work together. There are many scenarios that can be made within this facility from its design. The benefit to us and the community is well worth the cost. Dan said he believes it is not the building that is an issue, but more so a political statement to vote for it. Politically it will look good not to build it, but in a 6 million dollar budget it is a drop in a bucket. Dan said we are not talking about white dress uniforms, but at the same time this board voted on $50,000 medical insurance for one year at one meeting. Rick said if we get the facility that there is little we can cut in the budget except for firefighter income or even having to do away with personnel. Rick said the long term projection that Randy James presented tonight is basically what we have here on paper. Three years down the road we may have to cut manpower and the guys have to look at this. If we get too far out of the budget, then the board will have to come back and vote to cut personnel, insurance, uniforms, or something else. Maybe we have to look at it every year to balance the budget and not raise taxes. He does not want to have to cut into the capital carry forward. Don reiterated the facility is a very big priority. Next week at the board meeting the Board Members will have another opportunity to look at this after the Union reviews the facility. Don wants to see this training facility built. Don knows the board has a priority for firefighter safety. He said the economy is important, but if there is a way to make it work, he wants to come back with an alternative. Rick said if we can build a facility, not raise taxes and give the guys a raise then he would be happy. There was a discussion about the mil rates. Don said hopes in the next 25 days we will have a better perspective about Lockett Ranches. Don explained that the City of Flagstaff raised their rates for Lockett Ranches by 25%. One requirement by the county in any subdivision built is you must have fire protection within the subdivision. The representative for Lockett Ranches is pursuing a volunteer fire department. Don does not believe this subdivision has the demographics to support a volunteer department. Also, the ISO rating would rise dramatically, besides the fact all of these homes are worth a substantial amount of money. Don spoke of the other interests for our department in the near future, including the Navajo Nation Casino. Rick Parker said when it comes down to personnel issues we need to go into executive session. Don reminded them all the requirements for executive session, and will send them information concerning it, but they would be unable to go into it tonight. Rick discussed the executive chief position for Tina. He said as much as he likes Tina, he is sorry she is topped out on her salary, but under the current system that is the way it is. Even to take give her this new position this year would not be a problem, but with benefits and pay increases over the years the amount will go over 100,000. Don talked about Tina’ s job responsibilities (see work sheet). The responsibilities of her job that she has held for a number of years now far out-weigh those of the job description as an office manager. What she has done for a number of years is significantly different, and of much more importance. This year we will have five captains getting paid more than her. Gary suggested a title of administrative staff chief. Don talked of financial corporations, and how Tina’s job encompasses these types of responsibilities. He asked the board to compare these changes requested to the changes made at the hospital with a re-evaluation with pay to paramedics and EMTS’s, and how they came to make the needed changes in pay with job descriptions.. Tina has not worked as just an office manager for many years. She is probably one of the most important people in this department. This department has grown from 18 to 49 people, and he believes it is time to re-evaluate her position. Rick said he agrees with this but wonders about financing it within the budget. Jerry Loynachan spoke this new job position and suggested it be salary with the change. Jim Doskocil believes this is not the time, but down the road five years there could be a big increase. Dan asked Jim if he would be willing to work her position for the next 5 years with the same pay. Jim said this is the nature of the beast (pay step scale). Dan said Tina is different. Tina is not a firefighter, she is our accountant. Everything we are reading she has done. She is one of the most critical people to this department. Dan does not understand why a position as this one that every other person in this department would get a pay increase, but not this one. Rick asked what would be cut to pay for the raise. In 5 years where are you going to get the extra pay to justify this? Dan said he does not believe it a justified item to bypass with the job she does for the department. There was a discussion about fire personnel’s ability to move up to another position. Don said he is negligent for not bringing this up years ago. Over time her position has grown significantly, but no other positions have been made in the administration. The roles and responsibilities are significant for Tina, and the value that she has here. No one in this organization would want to take her job. There was further discussion about the new title and pay for Tina Dillahunty. Tina said her increase would be 1.93% this year (see work sheet). Don said he believes it is time to implement another step system for a new position. Rick suggested putting Tina in at a Captain rating and step system. Jerry said he did not mean this personally to Chief Howard, but you can lose the chief and be okay, but if you lose someone like Tina the corporation will be lost. Dan reminded them that an external auditor comes in every year and says we are doing an excellent job. Dan said he finds it difficult to stand behind an operation where everyone gets a raise but a position such as hers. Dan said he has tried in the past to bring up other areas to cut finances, especially medical insurance. Medical insurance is an area worth scrutinizing, and some areas are not worth scrutinizing. Rick asked about others in the department topping out on the pay scale. Dan went on to say that Tina has not had a cost of living raise for 2 years. With the growth and changes in this department - an additional fire department, additional stations and personnel, he believes the step scale she has been on needs to change. You cannot compare her to a firefighter. Rick said Tina told us she will not take an increase this year. Rick said we have to be more frugal; financial officers are used to not being compensated. Tina would like to say she believes Don is right, that my responsibilities have increased. An office manager is considered middle management, but her job description is not middle management with the responsibilities of Human Resources, financials, etc. Jerry said he can appreciate the concerns presented. He suggested something more creative be made in the salary schedule. Don talked about the work done for the Fort Valley Fire District. There was plenty of work to do before they even signed the contract with SFD for services. People worked free for a year. After the merge Tina now makes $8000 less, himself $5,000 less and Joann $2500 less. He worked 4 years to get Fort Valley Fire District on board. With a one million dollar operation, $25,000 was designated for one year for administration. Over this time frame we have grown 40%, and that is the avenue we are trying to address. At the next board meeting we will come back with additional alternatives. Jim asks are there any other items we should address in the budget work session tonight. Maintenance shop: Keith Klassen said revenues for work done on outside equipment are hard to predict. He educated the board members of the 40 additional pieces of apparatus in the surrounding areas. Pinewood, Highlands, Ponderosa, and City of Flagstaff would be eligible. He could not predict how many we may be able to work on in the near or far future. Keith and Mike Apodaca talked about charging for pump testing at this new facility. All of this could grow in the future. Show Low Fire said their maintenance facility is basically taking care of itself today from outside apparatus coming to the shop. This won’t happen in the first year, and it is up to these guys to get the income and apparatus here. Mike and Keith have already been approached by a manufacturer about doing warranty repair. First In is losing their Pierce dealership, so possibly they could pick up the warranty work for them. Keith said folks in the department will have to take the time to make it happen, but he truly thinks it can grow. Keith and Mike predicted bringing outside apparatus in for mechanical repairs within a year of the shops existence. Highlands Fire was interested in maintenance repair by Summit Fire two years ago. Mike said what is most important is being up to date with our own fleet. Not only does pump testing bring in revenue, but the repairs needed from these tests can be made in house for good income. Rick said he would like to discuss the Deputy Chief position. We hired Sam Whitted for three years. This commitment will be up in January 2011, and we could be willing to extend the time to July. Rick talked about vacating the deputy chief position after this and then seeing where the economy goes to determine whether it should be filled again or not. Next April we can make the decision about how long to keep him. Dan said one way or other things will be different. Don said the Deputy Chief is a critical position. Don reminded the Board Members on Saturday, May 22nd; Jim Pond is retiring and passing the Fire Chief baton to Mike Bradley. Dirch Foreman will become the Deputy Chief. This event begins at 3:00 pm at their main station on Kona Trail. There was a discussion held about the Navajo Nation Casino and the discussions Chief Howard and Deputy Chief Sam Whitted have had with the county. The date for completion is the fall of 2012. ADJOURNMENT: Rick Parker made a motion to adjourn the meeting and a second was made by Jim Doskocil. The vote in favor was unanimous and the meeting adjourned at 8:16 pm. Respectfully Submitted, Joann Benninghoff |
8905 N. Koch Field Rd. Flagstaff, AZ 86004 E-mail: sfdadm@infomagic.net
Phone: (928) 526-9537
Fax: (928) 526-2750
Fax: (928) 526-2750
| BUDGET WORK SESSION MAY 12, 2010 SUMMIT FIRE DISTRICT, STATION 32 Meeting Minutes |